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ENG

for this type of valve, for example, the maximum number of opening steps is 480.

Refrigerant type (par. PH)

This is used to set the type of refrigerant used in the system. The table below shows the possible types of
refrigerant and the associated values of PH. For compatibility with the E2V valve, see the manual for the
connected driver. Contact CAREL if installing E2V valves in systems that use refrigerants not listed in the
table.

Code Description

Def Min Max UOM User

User

terminal

PH

Refrigerant

Val. Desc.

Val. Desc.

Val. Desc.

0

Custom gas

14

R417A

28

HFO1234ze

1

R22

15

R422D

29

R455A

2

R134a

16

R413A

30

R170

3

R404A

17

R422A

31

R442A

4

R407C

18

R423A

32

R447A

5

R410A

19

R407A

33

R448A

6

R507A

20

R427A

34

R449A

7

R290

21

R245Fa

35

R450A

8

R600

22

R407F

36

R452A

9

R600a

23

R32

37

R508B

10

R717

24

HTR01

38

R452B

11

R744

25

HTR02

39

R513A

12

R728

26

R23

40

R454B

13

R1270

27

HFO1234yf

3

0

40

-

S

NO

Important:

if the type of refrigerant is incorrect, the superheat measurement will be wrong, with the

risk of liquid returning to the compressor.

In addition, a temperature/pressure conversion curve corresponding to an arbitrary new refrigerant can
be entered (custom gas) by writing from the supervisor suitable coefficients, a numeric ID for the gas and
the CRC protection value. The coefficients are provided by Carel. Once the new refrigerant has been
entered, it will be available by setting parameter PH to 0. The value 0 can only be applied if the cyclic
redundancy check (CRC) does not detect errors. If the coefficients are modified after having chosen to use
a custom refrigerant (PH = 0) and the CRC check fails, alarm GPE will be displayed on the user interface
and control will stop.

Superheat set point (par. P3)

Code

Description

Def

Min

Max

UOM

User

User

terminal

P3

Superheat set point

10

0

25

K

S

YES

The parameter that electronic valve control is based on is superheat, which effectively tells whether or
not there is liquid at the evaporator outlet. Superheat is calculated as the difference between:
superheated gas temperature (measured by a temperature sensor located at the end of the outlet tGS)
and the saturated evaporation temperature (calculated based on the reading of a pressure transducer
located at the evaporator outlet (PEu/tEu) and using the Tsat(P) conversion curve for each refrigerant)

SH = tGS - tEu

SH = superheat (K)

tGS = superheated gas temperature (°C/°F);

tEu = saturated evaporation temperature, converted from the pressure (°C/°F).

If superheat is high it means that the evaporation process is completed well before the evaporator outlet,
and therefore flow-rate of refrigerant through the valve is insufficient. This causes a reduction in cooling
efficiency due to the failure to exploit part of the evaporator.

74

| 5. Functions

0300086EN rel. 1.0 – 04.09.2018

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Содержание MPXone ACS00CB000010

Страница 1: ...MANUAL MPXone 0300086EN ENG Up to date version available on www carel com MPXone Electronic control for refrigeration applications ENG LEGGI E CONSERVA QUESTE ISTRUZIONI READ AND SAVE THESE INSTRUCTI...

Страница 2: ......

Страница 3: ...l do not drop hit or shake the device as the internal circuits and mechanisms may be irreparably damaged l do not use corrosive chemicals solvents or aggressive detergents to clean the device l do not...

Страница 4: ...delivering the product Carel has already completed the checks and tests required by the relevant European directives and harmonised standards using a typical test setup which however cannot be conside...

Страница 5: ...ands 25 3 USER INTERFACE 26 3 1 Introduction 26 3 2 User terminal and remote display 27 4 INITIAL CONFIGURATION 31 4 1 Wizard 31 4 2 APPLICA 31 4 3 Description of the initial configuration parameters3...

Страница 6: ......

Страница 7: ...ient temperature and humidity and glass temperature In addition up to four virtual probes are available physically connected to other devices and shared via the supervisor and can be used to manage on...

Страница 8: ...081 24Vpanel medium NFC BLE without connectors multiple pack 20 pcs S1M0007N0B110 DIN Medium 115 230V with connectors single package S1M0007N00111 DIN Medium 115 230V without connectors multiple pack...

Страница 9: ...lugs 1 m J2 ACS00CB000330 Kit of 8 coloured cables with lugs 3 m J3 1 2 1 Temperature sensors The temperature probe must be installed close to the evaporator outlet according to the usual installation...

Страница 10: ...pressure probes Fig 1 e P N Type Description Range SPKT0013R0 0 5V Evaporation pressure probe 1 to 9 3 SPKT0053R0 0 5V 1 to 4 2 SPKT0043R0 0 5V 0 to 17 3 SPKT0033R0 0 5V 0 to 34 5 SPKT00B6R0 0 5V 0 to...

Страница 11: ...module connector 0 1 single multiple pack 10 pcs Tab 1 c Transformer For the panel model P N Description TRA00AE24 0 1 230V 24V10VA panel transformer for Basic model 0 1 single multiple pack 10 pcs Ta...

Страница 12: ...d installation near transmitting antennae l exposure to direct sunlight and the elements in general l wide and rapid fluctuations in ambient temperature l exposure to dust formation of corrosive patin...

Страница 13: ...deviation of the rectangular opening from flat surface 0 5 mm l thickness of the electrical panel sheet metal 0 8 2 mm l maximum roughness of the surface where the gasket is applied 120 m Note the thi...

Страница 14: ...n the DIN rail until the rear tab clicks into place 2 3 3 Removal Use a screwdriver as a lever in the hole to lift and release the tab The tab is held in the locked position by return springs 2 4 Desc...

Страница 15: ...Digital input 5 brown V Power supply to 4 20 mA active probes green S6 Analogue input 6 yellow VL remote display power supply grey ID4 Digital input 4 pink O GND blue S4 Analogue input 4 red J4 BMS se...

Страница 16: ...2 j Fig 2 k Possible connections Note O GND 2 6 Connection diagrams Note the APPLICA application can be used to change the configuration of the probes without needing to rewire or change the function...

Страница 17: ...2 6 1 Panel model Fig 2 l ENG MPXone 0300086EN rel 1 0 04 09 2018 2 Installation 17...

Страница 18: ...ENG 2 6 2 DIN rail model Fig 2 m 18 2 Installation MPXone 0300086EN rel 1 0 04 09 2018...

Страница 19: ...uit breakers or similar l reduce the path of the probe cables as much as possible and avoid spiral paths that enclose power devices l avoid touching or nearly touching the electronic components fitted...

Страница 20: ...controllers or controllers that are connected to each other in a Master Slave arrangement in which each Master controller can manage up to nine Slave controllers The following functional diagrams illu...

Страница 21: ...er controller connected to the supervisor network coordinates the operation of up to 9 Slave controllers connected to the network via RS485 Fieldbus Each controller can be connected to a remote displa...

Страница 22: ...ENG DIN Fig 2 s RS485 supervisor network Fig 2 t Fig 2 u 22 2 Installation MPXone 0300086EN rel 1 0 04 09 2018...

Страница 23: ...bserved when connecting the controllers l incorrect connection to the power supply may seriously damage the controller l use cable ends suitable for the corresponding terminals Loosen each screw and i...

Страница 24: ...roller 2 press PRG 3 power up the controller again while holding PRG at the end the number 0 is displayed which signifies the parameters have been reset to the default values 4 to reset the parameters...

Страница 25: ...smartphone 2 access the controller via NFC or Bluetooth entering your profile credentials 3 open the Scheduler section 4 define the day night time bands for the different days of the week 5 apply the...

Страница 26: ...eters is 33 and is different from the password for accessing the user levels U User S Assistance M Manufacturer on the APPLICA app See the parameter table l the unit of measure of the displayed values...

Страница 27: ...Manufacturer level parameters are set using the Applica app or the configuration software depending on the access profile See the parameter table l Parameters t1 and t2 are used to choose the variable...

Страница 28: ...xiliary output active Clock Scheduler active Energy saving Smooth Lines active Defrost Defrost active Awaiting defrost Service Maintenance request HACCP HACCP active Tab 3 a 3 2 3 Standard display At...

Страница 29: ...eters is displayed Ctl Control 7 Press DOWN until reaching parameter St set point and PRG to display the value 8 Press UP DOWN to modify the value 9 Press PRG to save the setting and return to the par...

Страница 30: ...lean cabinet ON Unit ON rH Anti sweat heater Procedure 1 go to the standard display 2 press PRG Lht is displayed 3 press PRG to turn the light on off and DOWN to move to the next direct function 4 fol...

Страница 31: ...and the Master Slave network l management of the electronic valve if featured Note the configuration wizard can also be l run via the APPLICA app l skipped by creating a parameter configuration using...

Страница 32: ...tial configuration procedure Basic Medium Tab 4 a not displayed if In 0 Important at the end of the configuration wizard the unit will be ON and the temperature set point 50 C 4 3 Description of the i...

Страница 33: ...k Note only the Master controller needs to be connected to the RS485 serial line connector J4 BMS all of the Slave controllers communicate with the supervisor via the Master connected to the master s...

Страница 34: ...escription Def Min Max UOM User User terminal H3 BMS serial port protocol 0 1 Carel slave Modbus slave 1 0 1 S NO P1 Type of probe group 1 S1 S2 S3 This is used to select the type of temperature probe...

Страница 35: ...55A 2 R134a 16 R413A 30 R170 3 R404A 17 R422A 31 R442A 4 R407C 18 R423A 32 R447A 5 R410A 19 R407A 33 R448A 6 R507A 20 R427A 34 R449A 7 R290 21 R245Fa 35 R450A 8 R600 22 R407F 36 R452A 9 R600a 23 R32 3...

Страница 36: ...minimum limits of the PEu probe s range of measurement Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal UE Maximum value for saturated evap pressure temp probe PEu tEu 9 3 LE 200 C F M NO LE Minimu...

Страница 37: ...NTC 50T90 C Pt1000 50T150 C 0 to 5 V ratiometric 4 to 20 mA 0 to 10 Vactive probes PWM 0 to 10 Vdc BASIC S1M0004W0B06 0 1 YES NO NO NO NO NO NO MEDIUM S1M0006W0B07 0 1 YES YES YES YES YES YES YES S1M0...

Страница 38: ...pressure value shared by the Master and used for calculating the local superheat This is used to save on the installation costs of a pressure probe for each evaporator assuming that the pressure drop...

Страница 39: ...ration FA 0 and Fc 0 on a Master controller causes the alarm rE control probe alarm l if the Slave controller is not accessible from the Master alarm MA is displayed Communication error with the Maste...

Страница 40: ...t alters the measured value Verify that you have authorisation and record the changes where required Fig 5 b Ref Description T1 Outlet temperature read by the probe T2 Outlet temperature value calibra...

Страница 41: ...error the logic of the functions associated with the digital inputs using parameters rIA rIb rIr can be reversed Par Description Def UOM Min Max rIA rIb rIr Reverse digital input logic 0 0 1 Note rev...

Страница 42: ...sable any defrost calls When the contact is open all defrost calls are ignored Par d5 can be used to delay activation Note l if the contact is open while a defrost is in progress this is immediately s...

Страница 43: ...noid comp and evap fans OFF digital input see DIA 0 1 5 S NO DOE Assign light digital output see DOA 4 0 4 S NO H14 Time light stays on after closing the door 0 0 240 min U NO Ad Delay time for high a...

Страница 44: ...During night status l the night time set point Stn is used for control calculated based on the set point St plus the offset defined by parameter r4 Stn St r4 The control probe can also be modified ac...

Страница 45: ...or not the time set for parameter dIt has elapsed Special features l when the Timer variable is ON following the rising edge of a digital input another transition from OFF to ON of the same digital i...

Страница 46: ...ll switch on This operating mode can be configured by setting parameter DIP with one of the digital inputs Opening the door introduces a temperature alarm delay as described for the door switch functi...

Страница 47: ...OQ If the opposite logic to the default setting is required or to correct a wiring error the logic of the functions associated with the digital outputs using parameters rOA rOb rOp can be reversed Cod...

Страница 48: ...ions on the user terminal using a command from the supervisor and based on the changeover in day night status linked to the curtain door switch or the setting of the time bands activation deactivation...

Страница 49: ...st temperature probe Sd see FA 2 4 6 S NO FF Assign defrost temperature probe 2 Sd2 see FA 0 4 6 S NO DOG Assign defrost digital output see DOA 1 0 4 S NO DOH Assign auxiliary evaporator defrost digit...

Страница 50: ...tor Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal DOP Assign drain heater digital output see DOA 0 0 4 M NO Anti sweat heater par DOQ Selection of the digital output for demisting the glass cont...

Страница 51: ...ecord keeping and authorisation Example vertical showcase Fig 5 e Ref Description Sm Outlet probe air off Sr Intake probe air on Ref Description Sv Virtual probe During the day most of the load in a r...

Страница 52: ...oint can be set by parameter Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal r1 Minimum set point 50 50 r2 C F M NO r2 Maximum set point 50 r1 50 C F M NO Night time operation During night time op...

Страница 53: ...r if r6 1 or on Sv if r6 0 Weighted control and double thermostat can be used for automatic changeover to night time operation without an external signal Weighted control This function compensates for...

Страница 54: ...NO3 1 digital output 1 NO1 4 digital output 4 NO4 2 digital output 2 NO2 3 0 4 S NO r7 Master solenoid valve configuration 0 1 local valve network valve connected to Master 0 0 1 S NO If configured a...

Страница 55: ...splay the probe alarms rE E1 E2 E3 etc and errors EE EF Etc Edc alternating with the message OFF When OFF the following alarms are reset l high and low temperature l open door alarm dor l valve LSA Lo...

Страница 56: ...b1 0 At night the intake probe is controlled and the outlet probe always signals the request in the day the outlet probe is controlled and the intake probe always signals the request l when one of the...

Страница 57: ...offset with probe error parameter ro Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal ro Control offset with probe error 0 0 20 C F S NO MPXone in standard mode uses the virtual probe Sv for contro...

Страница 58: ...g operation par c4 Duty setting is a special function used to maintain control in emergency situations with errors in the temperature control probes until a service intervention In the event of a temp...

Страница 59: ...d AL or AL2 can be delayed by setting parameter c6 Important the unit of measure of parameter cc is hours Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal cc Running time in continuous cycle 0 Disa...

Страница 60: ...atus This operating mode is highlighted on the Master user interface by the corresponding icons on steady the Slave controllers ignore the Master control mode and manage the display as normal solenoid...

Страница 61: ...ime dP1 At the end of the defrost the dripping phase may begin if dd 0 during which the solenoid valve is closed and the fans are off followed by the post dripping phase if Fd 0 during which control r...

Страница 62: ...efrost d0 0 2 4 duty cycle The duty cycle refers to the default values of parameters F2 and F3 The electronic valve can be opened to the initial value set for cP1 for a period equal to Pdd Fig 5 q Ref...

Страница 63: ...Maximum interval between consecutive defrosts par dI Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal dI Maximum interval between consecutive defrosts 8 0 240 hours S YES Parameter dI is a safety p...

Страница 64: ...to Saturday 1 to 7 Monday to Sunday 10 Saturday Sunday 8 Monday to Friday 11 every day Note l if event td1 includes a series of days the programming always ends at 24 00 on the last day If event td1 i...

Страница 65: ...n Max UOM User User terminal dd Dripping time after defrost fans off 0 no dripping 2 0 15 min S NO This parameter is used to stop the compressor and the evaporator fans following a defrost so as to al...

Страница 66: ...be frozen and a defrost is activated The time is reset if the temperature returns above the threshold Code Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal dt1 End defrost temperature read by Sd 8 50 50...

Страница 67: ...lues dS1 and dS2 and the defrost is considered completed Control resumes 2 ONTIME is reset instant A OFFTIME iis reset with the default value and the natural defrost starts lasting the entire time dS1...

Страница 68: ...ters td1 to td8 so as to allow the user to choose the conditions that are most suitable for this special procedure Power defrost is activated when at least one of the increases ddt or ddP has any valu...

Страница 69: ...Probe set by parameter FSa Sb Probe set by parameter FSb F1 Fan activation threshold Ref Description Frd Differential t time FAN Evaporator fans The fans can be turned off in the following situations...

Страница 70: ...y parameter FSb F5 Fan cut off temperature F1 Fan activation threshold Ref Description Frd Differential t time FAN Evaporator fans The advanced parameters for the evaporator fans concern the minimum a...

Страница 71: ...ondition Cause Glass temperature probe not valid l physical probe not configured or faulty l the estimated glass temperature probe value cannot be used as the outlet probe or intake probe is not confi...

Страница 72: ...cription Svt Glass temperature probe Min Minimum fan speed Max Maximum fan speed Min fixed minimum output of 10 Max fixed maximum output of 100 The action is proportional only if the estimate of the g...

Страница 73: ...which is automatically converted to saturated temperature based on specific tables for the type of refrigerant used Description of operation The values read by the probes described above are called l...

Страница 74: ...coefficients are provided by Carel Once the new refrigerant has been entered it will be available by setting parameter PH to 0 The value 0 can only be applied if the cyclic redundancy check CRC does n...

Страница 75: ...re E Forced air evaporator Ref Description EEV Electronic expansion valve P Evaporation pressure MPXone with PID control tends to maintain the actual superheat calculated based on the probe readings a...

Страница 76: ...tion that is directly proportional to the difference between the set point and the actual superheat value It acts on the speed of the valve in terms of steps C The valve moves P4 steps for every degre...

Страница 77: ...K S NO Note Smooth Lines is not compatible with traditional Floating Suction control and must be used with the new Rack Smart Set algorithm 5 6 1 Protection functions LowSH low superheat threshold par...

Страница 78: ...ntegral action to return the evaporation pressure below the set threshold The protection function has been designed to allow a gradual return to normal operating conditions that is when the critical c...

Страница 79: ...4 0 MOP alarm disabled PM5 allows the local or network solenoid valve if available based on the configuration of the system see parameter r7 to be closed upon activation of the MOP alarm The solenoid...

Страница 80: ...oid valve Fig 5 ae Ref Description T_ SUCT Suction temperature P11 LSA low suction temperature threshold P12 LSA alarm delay Ref Description t Time LSA Protection LOP Minimum evaporation pressure This...

Страница 81: ...ode Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal PMP Enable manual expansion valve positioning 0 1 disabled enabled 0 0 1 S NO PMu Manual valve position 0 600 steps S NO PMP is used to enable disabl...

Страница 82: ...that only displays the saturated evaporation temperature calculated by the corresponding evaporation pressure probe or read directly by the NTC probe advanced parameter FE 82 5 Functions MPXone 03000...

Страница 83: ...rt at the same time avoiding potential problems of electrical overload In models with Carel electronic expansion valve and Ultracap technology this parameter must be set to a value greater than 2 l c1...

Страница 84: ...ters and the level S password also allows access to the User parameters Par Description Def UOM Min Max U PDM Manufacturer password 044 0 999 S PDS Service password 022 0 999 S PDU User password 0 999...

Страница 85: ...0 4 6 S NO FL Assign ambient humidity probe SU see FA 0 4 6 S NO FM Assign glass temperature probe Svt see FA 0 4 6 S NO Fn Assign dewpoint value SdP see FA 0 4 6 S NO cA Air off temp probe Sm calibr...

Страница 86: ...nput logic see rIA 0 0 1 S NO rId Start defrost digital input logic see rIA 0 0 1 S NO rIE Door switch with solenoid comp and fans OFF digital input logic see rIA 0 0 1 S NO rIF Remote ON OFF digital...

Страница 87: ...0 not configured 1 analogue output 1 Y1 2 analogue output 2 Y2 0 0 2 M NO Ab Assign analogue output for modulating valve see AA 0 0 2 M NO Ac Assign analogue output for modulating anti sweat heaters...

Страница 88: ...50 C F S NO dP1 Maximum defrost duration 45 1 240 min S YES dP2 Max secondary evap defrost duration 45 1 240 min S NO d4 Defrost on power up Master network defrost Slave local defrost 0 1 No Yes 0 0...

Страница 89: ...s and 0 minutes 3 8 ore 0 minutes 8 3 hours and 0 minutes 13 1 hour and 0 minutes 4 6 ore 0 minutes 9 2 hours and 40 minutes 14 30 minutes 0 0 14 S NO d2S Number of daily defrosts td2 see d1S 0 0 14 S...

Страница 90: ...threshold 7 10 P3 K S YES P8 LowSH integral time 0 function disabled 15 0 240 s M NO P9 LowSH alarm delay 0 alarm disabled 600 0 999 s M NO P10 Enable close solenoid valve for low superheat LowSH and...

Страница 91: ...e Smooth Lines 120 0 800 s S NO PSP Proportional gain Smooth Lines 5 0 100 S NO Solenoid compressor c0 Delay to enable solenoid comp and evap fans on power up 0 0 240 min M NO c1 Min time between cons...

Страница 92: ...1 not enabled enabled 1 0 1 S NO Add High temp alarm bypass time for door open 30 1 240 min U NO Htd HACCP alarm delay 0 moniotring disabled 0 0 240 min S NO Connectivity In Type of unit 0 1 Slave Ma...

Страница 93: ...S NO t2 Display on remote display see t1 12 0 14 S NO H5 Enable keypad and NFC functions 0 1 Disabled Enabled 1 0 1 U NO H8 Buzzer 0 1 No Yes 1 0 1 U NO Day Night tS1 8 d Start time band 1 to 8 day da...

Страница 94: ...onnect to Fig 6 at Note during the first connection the Applica app aligns itself with the software version on the MPXone controller via a cloud connection this means a mobile data connection is neede...

Страница 95: ...the default values loaded by Carel on the MPXone controller simply follow the same procedure as described above and in step 6 select Apply default values rather than Copy values to configuration 6 2...

Страница 96: ...ts 3 24 Vinput 2 Control device construction Device to be incorporated Terminal block Plug in male female Cable size see Main board description of the terminals User interface Buzzer built in not incl...

Страница 97: ...0 to 5 Vratiometric probes Maximum current delivered 10 mA protected against short circuits V 8 11 Vto power the 4 20 mA current probes Maximum current delivered 25 mA protected against short circuit...

Страница 98: ...pin Microfit crimp connector 0 05 0 52 20 24 AWG 10 J3 Inputs S4 S6 ID3 ID4 ID5 8 pin Microfit crimp connector 0 05 0 52 20 24 AWG 10 J4 BMS Plug in screw terminal 3 pin pitch 3 81 0 081 1 31 500 J5...

Страница 99: ...external contact immediate or delayed See Digital inputs The display shows IA and at the same time the alarm icon triangle flashes and the buzzer is activated If more than one error occurs these are d...

Страница 100: ...d unchanged YES NO E14 Serial probe S14 not updated OFF OFF automatic duty setting c4 unchanged unchanged unchanged YES NO LO Low temperature ON ON automatic unchanged unchanged unchanged unchanged YE...

Страница 101: ...H and low AL temperature alarms 0 Not configured 1 Air off Sm 2 Defrost Sd 3 Air on Sr 4 Superheated gas tGS 5 Reserved 6 Defrost 2 Sd2 7 Auxiliary 1 Saux1 8 Auxiliary 2 Saux2 9 Ambient SA 10 Reserved...

Страница 102: ...mp alarm 2 threshold 0 50 50 C F S NO Ad Delay time for high and low temp alarms AH AL 120 0 240 min U YES Ad2 Delay time for high and low temp alarms AH2 AL2 30 1 240 min U NO Note l the LO LO2 and H...

Страница 103: ...ype HA alarms high temperature during operation example The critical temperature was exceeded the alarm was not managed and the temperature remained above the threshold for longer than the maximum tol...

Страница 104: ...reshold ALARM Type HA HACCP alarm Ref Description Ad Delay time for high and low temperature alarms Htd HACCP alarm delay 0 monitoring disabled t Time Ht0 HACCP alarms present 0 0 1 S NO HAn Number of...

Страница 105: ...reshold HFn indicates the number of type HF alarms activated Par Description Def Min Max UOM User User terminal HFn Number of type HF alarms 0 0 15 S NO Fig 8 d Ref Description S Measurement probe St...

Страница 106: ...ENG 9 Release notes Software version Manual version Description 1 1 23 08 2018 1 0 04 09 2018 First release Tab 9 a 106 9 Release notes MPXone 0300086EN rel 1 0 04 09 2018...

Страница 107: ......

Страница 108: ...a dell Industria 11 35020 Brugine Padova Italy Tel 39 049 9716611 Fax 39 049 9716600 email carel carel com www carel com MPXone 0300086EN rel 1 0 04 09 2018 CAREL can accept no responsibility for poss...

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