GRAUPNER 6478 Скачать руководство пользователя | Manualshive

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Содержание 6478

Страница 1: ...1 55 PAGE Operating Manual ULTRA DUO PLUS 60 Order No 6478 No liability for printing errors Modifications reserved ...

Страница 2: ... menu flow 15 0 3 Control key select flow 16 1 Memory and battery setup menu screen 17 2 Charge setup menu flow 19 3 Discharge setup screen 22 4 Cycle menu screen 24 5 Step charge menu screen 25 6 Balancer Menü 27 7 Data view screen 29 8 Tyre battery heater battery heater screen POWER SUPPLY 32 9 Motor run in screen 34 10 Config setup screen 36 11 Start select menu screen 38 12 Battery select menu...

Страница 3: ...hanically robust can be used in any attitude and are generally highly reliable They require no special measures for storage apart from protecting the cells from becoming deep discharged The CHARGER can also be used to discharge your batteries and balance the cells in a pack Note It is important always to observe the charging instructions supplied by the battery manufacturer and to keep to the reco...

Страница 4: ...mable and volatile materials well away from the charging area Provide good ventilation Defective batteries can explode or burn Connect the charger 12DC input directly to the car battery using the original cables and connectors supplied The car s engine must be stopped all the time the CHARGER is connected to the car s battery Do not recharge the car battery at any time when the CHARGER is connecte...

Страница 5: ... charging packs consisting of a small number of cells If the cells feature has a poorly defined voltage peak the charger may fail to detect the fully charged state Before charging please check have you selected the appropriate charge program for the battery Have you set the correct charge or discharge current Have you set the important cut off voltage when charging Ni Cd and Ni MH packs Are all co...

Страница 6: ...etween a pack s internal resistance cable resistance and connector transfer resistance the first requirement if the charger is to work perfectly is that the charge lead should be of adequate conductor cross section and should be not be more than 30 cm long Good quality connectors gold contact types must be fitted to both ends Charging transmitter batteries A battery installed in a radio control tr...

Страница 7: ...eration of our products or which are connected with such operation in any way Use only GRAUPNER or GM Racing charge leads batteries and accessories A 4 RECOMMENDED CHARGE LEADS POLARITY The requirements made on rechargeable batteries vary greatly according to their particular application and this in turn calls for different types of battery connector Please note that connectors connector names and...

Страница 8: ... the GRAUPNER BALANCER CONNECTOR of your battery with 3 8 poles right handed into the BALANCER CONNECTOR of the used OUTPUT Input 11 15V DC 5 40A Input 100 240V AC Graph LCDisplay 1 Balancer connector 2 Temperature sensor 2 PC mini USB Interface Temperature sensor 1 Balancer connector 1 Fan Fan Graph LCDisplay 2 Output 2 Output 1 Control keys LED Output 1 LED Output 2 GRAUPNER BALANCER CONNECTOR T...

Страница 9: ...our packs in order to establish whether the charge process is terminated reliably Warm batteries offer much higher performance than cold ones so don t be surprised if your batteries don t seem so effective in the winter Overcharging and deep discharging batteries lead to irreparable damage to the cells and permanently reduces their maximum performance and effective capacity Never store batteries f...

Страница 10: ...ot dispose of them in the domestic rubbish The retail outlet where you purchase your batteries should have a battery recycling container for proper disposal Trade outlets are obliged by law to accept exhausted batteries for disposal DELTA PEAK CHARGE TERMINATION for NiCd NiMH Batteries CC CV CHARGING METHOD FOR LiPo LiIo LiFe Batteries These programs are only suitable for charging and discharging ...

Страница 11: ...g overheating and even exploding If the final charge voltage of 3 6 V cell LiFePO4 4 1 V cell Lithium Ion or 4 2 V cell Lithium Polymer and Lithium Manganese is exceeded by more than 1 the lithium ions in the cell start to change into metallic lithium This material reacts very violently with the water in the electrolyte and this can result in the cell exploding On the other hand it is also importa...

Страница 12: ...same way which makes it much easier for the user to handle his equipment The files generated by LogView can also be used directly by any other user even if he does not have actual physical access to the device in question Additional software features include High performance graphics engine with numerous analysis and measurement functions Wide ranging options are available for adjusting the displa...

Страница 13: ...Page 13 55 ...

Страница 14: ...attery charging Capable of charging single cells therefore ideal for glow energizer batteries and for cell selection processes Charges LiPo LiIo LiFe and lead acid cells using constant current constant voltage method Declining current curve after final charge voltage with automatic charge termination Charge processes NiCd NiMH Automatic normal linear GMVIS IMPULSE REFLEX RE PEAK staged charging Li...

Страница 15: ...60 GRAUPNER 6478 V1 0 USER NAME MEMORY 01 01 NEW BATTERY NAME CYCLE D C D 00T C00 D00min STEP CHARGE D ON d00mV C 00 C BALANCE 0CL 0 00Vpk 0 00Va DATA VIEW 0 0Vi 0 00Vo 0 0 C Connect the charger main plug to the input 100 240V AC or the 4mm banana plugs to 11 15V DC see A 6 HEATER POWER __0m __0 C __0m __0 C MOTOR RUN CONFIG 00 00 2000 am00 00 00 ...

Страница 16: ...UT SELECT button is pressed OUTPUT LED should be changed The OUTPUT LED is automatically changed in the following conditions When error occurs If OUTPUT2 is now selected and if error occurs in OUTPUT1 the output should be automatically changed to OUTPUT1 When operation is finished If OUTPUT2 is now selected and if operation is finished in OUTPUT1 the output should be automatically changed to OUTPU...

Страница 17: ...6789 _ ä ö ü é è BATT NAME SETUP 2 2 01 NiMH GP 6N 4600 ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQR STUVWXYZabcdefghijk lmnopqrstuvwxyz0123 456789 _ ä ö ü é è BATTERY SETUP 1 2 TYPE NiMH VOLTS _6CL _7 2V CAPACITY _4600mAh NEW 01 01 2008 BATTERY SETUP 1 2 TYPE NiMH VOLTS _6CL _7 2V CAPACITY _4600mAh NEW 01 01 2008 BATTERY SETUP 1 2 TYPE NiMH VOLTS _6CL _7 2V CAPACITY _4600mAh NEW 01 01 2008 BATTERY SETUP 1 2 TYPE NiMH VOLT...

Страница 18: ... select the memory and press button Set your wanted battery cell or voltage and capacity If battery type is changed all setting parameters should be initialized and TRACE DAT in DAT VIEW mode is clear Input the purchasing date of your battery day month year If battery type is changed the purchasing date on your battery should be automatically changed to present date In 0 memory if battery type is ...

Страница 19: ... DELAY _3min TRICKLE _AUTO CUT TEMP _50 C CHARGE SETUP 2 2 MAX CAPACITY 125 SAFETY TIMER _75min FLAT CHECK _OFF REPEAK CYCLE 1T REPEAK DELAY _30min CHARGE SETUP 2 2 MAX CAPACITY 125 SAFETY TIMER _75min FLAT CHECK _OFF REPEAK CYCLE 1T REPEAK DELAY _30min CHARGE SETUP 2 2 MAX CAPACITY 125 SAFETY TIMER _75min FLAT CHECK _OFF REPEAK CYCLE 1T REPEAK DELAY _30min CHARGE SETUP 1 1 CHG CURRENT _2 1A CHG V...

Страница 20: ...ELAY This function is not to detect delta peak which could happen at the initial stage of charging and which could happen due to the chemical reaction internal battery Normal settings are 3 5min 2 4 TRICKLE This current is to compensate battery self discharge after NICD NiMH fast charging As for Lithium battery CV constant voltage is activated instead of trickle charge 2 5 CUT TEMP Connect the tem...

Страница 21: ...s message could be also shown f e 4800mAh 0 1A Charge You can turn on or off for this FLAT CHECK function 2 9 REPEAK CYCLE This is to recharge battery pack which is charged This mode should be activated when it moves to REPEAK mode from CHARGE PROCESS Since this function is to charge again the fully charged battery this PEAK DELAY should be automatically set to 0 PEAK DELAY setting value is not ch...

Страница 22: ...LiIo cells should be never discharge lower as 3 0V cell for the highest possible life time Deep Discharge can cause capacity loss and in the worst case it can destroy the battery and cause explosion and fire Discharge is finished with smallest voltages with connecting the balancer cable the balancing port of the charger Even if the cable is connected during discharging discharge is not finished wi...

Страница 23: ...for NICD and NIMH batteries This mode should be activated when it moves to MATCH mode from DISCHARGE PROCESS To activate this mode balancing cable MUST be connected to the balancing port of the charger Discharge to selected voltages with selected discharge currents and match each cell voltage If the discharge cut off voltage is set to the same voltage as the match voltage the discharge current wil...

Страница 24: ...CH DELAY Set pause time before charging after discharging so the battery can cool down after discharging before the next charging starts CYCLE D C D 1T C00 D00min CYCLE SETUP 1 1 DIRECTION D C D CYCLE TIME _0 AF CHG DELAY _0min AF DCH DELAY _0min CYCLE SETUP 1 1 DIRECTION D C D CYCLE TIME _0 AF CHG DELAY _0min AF DCH DELAY _0min CYCLE SETUP 1 1 DIRECTION D C D CYCLE TIME _0 AF CHG DELAY _0min AF D...

Страница 25: ...V C 50 C 400 1600 3800 4500 4 0A 8 0A 6 0A 4 0A STEP CHARGE 1 2 D ON d 3mV C 50 C 400 1600 3800 4500 4 0A 8 0A 6 0A 4 0A STEP CHARGE 2 2 PEAK SENS _5mV C CUT TEMP _50 C TRICKLE CHG __OFF DISCHARGE _ON IMPULSE CHG 1 2 3 REFLEX CHG 1 2 3 STEP CHARGE 2 2 PEAK SENS _5mV C CUT TEMP _50 C TRICKLE CHG __OFF DISCHARGE _ON IMPULSE CHG 1 2 3 REFLEX CHG 1 2 3 STEP CHARGE 2 2 PEAK SENS _5mV C CUT TEMP _50 C T...

Страница 26: ...checked in each step 5 4 CUT TEMP Connect the temp sensor to battery and charge is finished when it reaches the selected temp This function is likely to be used more to prevent battery pack from being overheating rather than normal charge completion 5 5 TRICKLE CHG Set additional current after fast charging 5 6 DISCHARGE Set whether discharge is first activated before step charging If ON is set di...

Страница 27: ...00V CELL NO 3 _0 000V CELL NO 4 _0 000V CELL NO 5 _0 000V CELL NO 6 _0 000V CELL NO 7 _0 000V BALANCER 0N 0 000V 0 000Vc 0 000Vy A CL BALANCER 0N 0 000V 0 000Vc 0 000Vy A CL BALANCER 0N 0 000V 0 000Vc 0 000Vy M CL BALANCER 0N 0 000V 0 000Vc 0 000Vy M CL BALANCER 0N 0 000V 0 000Vc 0 000Vy M CL RESISTANCE 3 4 CELL NO 1 __0 0m CELL NO 2 __0 0m CELL NO 3 __0 0m CELL NO 4 __0 0m CELL NO 5 __0 0m CELL N...

Страница 28: ...O 0 0 000V Max cell number and voltage MIN NO 0 0 000V Min cell number and voltage 6 2 CELLS VOLTAGE 2 4 SCREEN Showing each cell voltage 6 3 CELLS RESISTANCE 3 4 SCREEN Showing each cell internal resistance 6 4 BALANCE GRAPHIC CL 0N Showing the selected cell voltage A M Select Auto or Manual for Y axis of the graph A Auto If Auto is set Vy and Vc are automatically set M Manual If Manual is set Vy...

Страница 29: ...Ah LAST DCHG ____0mAh MAX CHG ____0mAh MAX DCHG ____0mAh TOTAL CHARGES __0 NEW _0 _0 2000 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V A 0x 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V A 0x zoom auto 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V M 0x manual 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V M 0x Y axis value 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V M 0x center value 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V A 0x point value 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 ...

Страница 30: ...CLE DATA 0 2 4 Cycle number END 00 00 00 10 00 Date and Time for the cycle CHG CAP 0mAh Charged capacity PEAK VOLTS 0 000V Peak voltage during charging CHG RESITANCE 0 0m Battery internal resistance at charge DSCH CAP 0mAh Discharged capacity AVG DSCH 0 000V Average voltage during discharging DISCHG RES 0 0m Battery internal resistance at discharge Memory storage CHARGE DISCHARGE MODE Data is stor...

Страница 31: ...eck graph for voltage current and temperature in the graph Memory consists of ROM even if power is OFF the data still leaves 0x zoom It means time of X axis and 1 43 can be set Ex If one screen of X axis of 1X is 2minutes if 10x is set 20minutes can be shown in the screen The more zoom is bigger the less accuracy of the graph becomes AT AUTOZOOM A M auto manual Select Auto or Manual for Y axis A A...

Страница 32: ...__0 0 C CURRENT LIMIT _0 0A 4x POWER SUPPLY 2 2 VOLTAGE LIMIT 12 0V CURRENT LIMIT 5 0A POWER SUPPLY VOLTAGE LIMIT 12 0V CURRENT LIMIT 5 0A POWER RATE 50 AC POWER USED 60 0W _0 00V _0 0A 0 0W POWER HEATER START5 PROCESS POWER CTL HEAT T1 __0min _00 C DELAY __0min I _0 0A HEAT T2 __0min _00 C POWER HEATER START CONNECT __ CHECK __ POWER SUPPLY VOLTAGE LIMIT 12 0V CURRENT LIMIT 5 0A POWER RATE 50 AC ...

Страница 33: ...SET DELAY Set the delay time between heating setting 1 and setting 2 if need for better tyre performance SET TIME 2 Set operation time 2 When it reaches the selected operation time operation should stop SET TEMP 2 Set tire temperature 2 for the best racing temperature Control output in accordance with temperature CURRENT LIMIT Set max currents which is delivered to tire warmer The max current shou...

Страница 34: ... _0 00A _0CYCLE __0m00s 00000s MOTOR Test 3 3 Test voltage 0 0V 1st _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk 2nd _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk 3rd _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk 4th _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk 5th _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk 6th _0 0Aavg _0 0Apk MOTOR BREAK IN 1 3 SET VOLT _0 0V SET TIME __0m _0s RUNTIME 000m 00s VOLTAGE _0 00V CURRENT _0 00A MOTOR BREAK IN 1 3 SET VOLT _0 0V SET TIME __0m _0s RUNTIME 000m 00s VOLTAGE _0 00V CURRENT _0 00A Program Mode...

Страница 35: ...ors 9 2 Program Mode This mode is to program motor voltages It consists of 4 steps and user can set operation voltage operating time and pause time in each step The meaning of SPEED is speed which reaches the selected voltage when step is changed SPEED can be set to 1 5 and 1 is slowest and 5 is fastest The slowest speed is recommended for motors Cycle can be set and it can be repeated in 1 4 step...

Страница 36: ...ND __ON LANGUAGES _ENGLISH PC SETUP DISABLE SUPPLY _0 0V _0 0A INPUT POWER __0 0W CONFIG SETUP 2 4 TEMP SCALE C BUTTON SOUND __ON LANGUAGES _ENGLISH PC SETUP DISABLE SUPPLY _0 0V _0 0A INPUT POWER __0 0W CONFIG SETUP 2 4 TEMP SCALE C BUTTON SOUND __ON LANGUAGES _ENGLISH PC SETUP DISABLE SUPPLY _0 0V _0 0A INPUT POWER __0 0W CONFIG SETUP 2 4 TEMP SCALE C BUTTON SOUND __ON LANGUAGES _ENGLISH PC SETU...

Страница 37: ...ftware SUPPLY Set power voltage and current in case of using outside DC power If voltage and current are set input power is automatically calculated Output is limited in accordance with input power refer to page 13 on operation description 10 3 TIME SETUP Set the Date use the DOWN button to apply the setting If dial is used and moved this should be not applied Select RTC Real Time Clock and press ...

Страница 38: ... 01 2008 am10 00 00 STEP CHG START 5 DELAY TIME ____OFF EXPECT TIME __72min EXP FINISH am11 12 00 01 01 2008 am10 00 00 DISCHARGE START NiMH BATTERY CONNECT __ CHECK __ STEP CHG START NiMH BATTERY CONNECT __ CHECK __ CYCLE START NiMH BATTERY CONNECT __ CHECK __ CONNECTED CHECK 5 0 cells are now Connected at the Balancing port Right OUTPUT _0 000V BALANCER CONNECTION ADVISED SELECT CELLS Select 0 c...

Страница 39: ...TER START5 PROCESS POWER CTL HEAT T1 __0min _00 C DELAY __0min I _0 0A HEAT T2 __0min _00 C MOTOR START 5 PROCESS BREAK IN BALANCE START LiPo BATTERY CONNECT __ CHECK __ POWER HEATER START CONNECT __ CHECK __ MOTOR START CONNECT __ CHECK __ OPERATION SCREEN CONNECTED CHECK 5 0 cells are now Connected at the Balancing port Right OUTPUT _0 000V 3 sec 3 sec 3 sec 5 sec ...

Страница 40: ...delta peak voltage a NiCd NiMh Battery AUTOMATIC Battery cell and charge current are automatically gained Check battery internal resistance every specific time to calculate charge current and continue to charge Delta peak value is NiCd 8mV cell and NiMh 6mV cell Cutoff temp which is applied in charge is used b LiIo Po Fe Battery AUTOMATIC Battery cell and charge current are automatically gained Fo...

Страница 41: ...nds Charging every 2 seconds and pause every 6 seconds at the final stage of charging to prevent battery from being overheated or venting f IMPULSE This is only for NiCd NiMH battery Battery power could be improved mainly with old batteries Refer to IMPULSE 5 7 above g REPLEX This is only for NiCd NiMH battery Battery power could be improved mainly with old batteries but the life time could be red...

Страница 42: ...n output 2 can be charged separately If charging starts in CV LINK mode battery connected to the counterpart output can be also checked automatically Output where charge is being operated is a master output and the counterpart output is slave output All parameters in slave output are automatically gained from the master output so only hardware of the slave output is used However cell information i...

Страница 43: ...ined every one minute d LINEAR Continues to discharge without stopping Internal resistance is gained one time only 3 minutes after starting discharge e MATCH refer to 3 5 MATCHED VOLT When each cell voltage tolerance is higher as 7mV discharge is checked cell balancing is active and CHK MATCHED should be shown on the screen If the cell voltage tolerance becomes within 7mV it shows END MATCHED Chec...

Страница 44: ... 120W Expected time can vary in accordance with selected input power in CONFIG SETUP In order to activate delay operation DELAY TIMER 000min should be changed This mode is based on the present time to reserve time to be finished When expect time is set EXP FINSH am00 00 00 Expected finished time should be shown on the screen EXP FINISH DELAY TIME EXPECT TIME ACTUAL TIME RTC If expected time is ove...

Страница 45: ... press the ESC button and recheck battery cell number or selected cell number If selected cell number and connected cell number is not matched CONNECTION ERROR display should be shown on the screen If cell number is manually set without connecting the balancing cable to the balancing port of the charger warn message should be shown on the screen With connected balancer connector in LiPo LiIo LiFe ...

Страница 46: ...CLE DATA _0 2 4 END 01 01 08 am10 00 CHG CAP ____0mAh PEAK VOLTS _0 000V CHG RESITANCE__0 0m DCHG CAP ____0mAh AVG DCHG _0 000V DISCHG RES __0 0m TRACE DATA 3 4 MIN RES __0 0m LAST CHG ____0mAh LAST DCHG ____0mAh MAX CHG ____0mAh MAX DCHG ____0mAh TOTAL CHARGES __0 NEW 15 12 2007 0 00 00 0 00V GR V 0 000Vc 0 000V A 0x BALANCE 1 3 BATT CELLS _0CELL PACK VOLTS _0 000V AVG VOLTS _0 000V GAP VOLTS _0 ...

Страница 47: ..._0 00A RESISTANCE __0 0m BATT TEMP __0 0 C CYCLE DELAY LEFT TIME __0m 00s CYCLE __C D _1 10 OUTPUT _0 000V BATT TEMP __0 0 C NORMAL DISCHARGE CYCLE C D 1 10 TIME _0 00 00 CAPACITY _____0mAh VOLTAGE _0 000V CURRENT _0 00A RESISTANCE __0 0m BATT TEMP __0 0 C NORMAL DISCHARGE CYCLE D C 1 10 TIME _0 00 00 CAPACITY _____0mAh VOLTAGE _0 000V CURRENT _0 00A RESISTANCE __0 0m BATT TEMP __0 0 C CYCLE DELAY...

Страница 48: ... BATT TEMP __0 0 C REPEAK CHARGE CYCLE NUMBER 1 05 TIME _0 00 00 CAPACITY _____0mAh VOLTAGE _0 000V CURRENT _0 00A RESISTANCE __0 0m BATT TEMP __0 0 C REPEAK DELAY LEFT TIME __0m 00s CYCLE NUMBER _0 00 OUTPUT _0 000V BATT TEMP __0 0 C 4STEP CHARGE STEP 02 i r TIME _0 00 00 CAPACITY _____0mAh VOLTAGE _0 000V CURRENT _0 00A RESISTANCE __0 0m BATT TEMP __0 0 C 4STEP CHARGE STEP 03 i r TIME _0 00 00 C...

Страница 49: ...RUN TIME __0m _00s TEMPERATURE __0 0 C CURRENT _0 0A OPERATING SET TIME 1 __0min SET TEMP 1 __0 C DELAY TIME __0min RUN TIME __0m _00s TEMPERATURE __0 0 C CURRENT _0 0A COMPLETED SET TIME 2 __0min SET TEMP 2 __0 C RUN TIME __0m _00s TEMPERATURE __0 0 C CURRENT _0 0A OPERATING SET VOLT _0 00V SET TIME __0m _0s RUN TIME 000m 00s VOLTAGE _0 00V CURRENT _0 00A COMPLETED SET VOLT _0 00V SET TIME __0m _...

Страница 50: ... EXP FINSH Expected finished time is indicated This should be not shown in Auto charge discharge cycle REPEAK CHG operation FINISH TIME When operation is finished and END is shown time is indicated This should be not shown during operation CLOCK DATE Showing present time and date CHG POWER RATE setting Can set wattage rate of two outputs While charging is being proceeded in both outputs and if wat...

Страница 51: ... activated like balance menu above pos 6 13 2 CYCLE OPERATION SCREEN It shows an order of cycle operation 13 3 STEP CHARGE OPERATION SCREEN It shows an order of STEP CHARGE If DISCHARGE OFF is set wait for reserve time then starts charging If DISCHARGE ON is set discharges first then wait for reserve time If DISCHARGE ON is set wait for one minute then starts charging Shows step number being used ...

Страница 52: ...reverse or is defective BAT TEMP TOO LOW Battery temp is too low to be operated OUTPUT _0 000V BATT TEMP __0 0 F BAT TEMP TOO HIGH Battery temp is too high to be operated OUTPUT _0 000V BATT TEMP __0 0 F INTERNAL TEMP Internal temp is too hot Contact Hobby Services if this message appears often DATA COMMUNICATION Something is wrong with the internal circuit Contact Hobby Services BAL VOLTAGE HIGH ...

Страница 53: ...eral Operating voltage range DC input 11 0 to 15 V Operating voltage range AC input 100 240V Car battery required 12 V min 50 Ah Mains PSU required 11 15V min 5 40A stabilized1 No load current drain approx 0 3 0 6 A balancer connector 1 7 NiMH NiCd LiPo LiIo LiFe cells balancing current NiMH NiCd 0 3A LiPo LiIo LiFe 0 4A Output 3 12V DC max 5A Low voltage cut off approx 11 0 V Weight approx 2 2kg ...

Страница 54: ...ave to remove electronic parts like servos receiver or speed controller from the product in question and these parts must be disposed of with a corresponding collection point for electrical scrap If you don t know the location of your nearest disposal centre please enquire at your local council office EU Conformity Declaration We hereby declare that the following product ULTRA DUO PLUS 60 Order No...

Страница 55: ... purchase e g invoice receipt delivery note and this guarantee card He must send the defective goods to us at his own cost using the following address Graupner GmbH Co KG Service Department Henriettenstr 94 96 D 73230 Kirchheim Teck Germany The purchaser should state the material defect or manufacturing fault or the symptoms of the fault in as accurate a manner as possible so that we can check if ...

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